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  • Garage league officials must clean up act

    Read all aboot'it

    "Can't buy what I want because it's free...
    Can't buy what I want because it's free..."
    -- Pearl Jam, from the single Corduroy

  • #2
    Every once in a while Bernie gets it right. I only wish he would have stayed on subject.

    This league will never change until it contracts. Players and refs.

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    • #3
      Hilarious and completely off-base. Every time something like the Bertuzzi incident takes place, columnists around the country whine about how officials lost control of the game. Then they try to gain control of the game early yesterday and columnists complain that they over-officiated.

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      • #4
        did you watch both games dev? Two different sets of rules. How can you play a game like that?

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        • #5
          You adjust.

          The Sharks, the young and unexperienced team were able to do it.

          The Blues, the older and experienced team, weren't able to do it.
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          • #6
            Originally posted by CSD@Apr 13 2004, 02:10 AM
            You adjust.

            The Sharks, the young and unexperienced team were able to do it.

            The Blues, the older and experienced team, weren't able to do it.
            Yup

            "Can't buy what I want because it's free...
            Can't buy what I want because it's free..."
            -- Pearl Jam, from the single Corduroy

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            • #7
              ok maybe i'm missing something....in golf you adjust to the wind, terrain...but the rules don't change. Baseball you adjust to the pitchers, weather....but the rules don't change.

              How do you adjust when the rules change? There has to be a consitancy.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by STLCeltic@Apr 13 2004, 03:14 AM
                ok maybe i'm missing something....in golf you adjust to the wind, terrain...but the rules don't change. Baseball you adjust to the pitchers, weather....but the rules don't change.

                How do you adjust when the rules change? There has to be a consitancy.
                You must be missing something then because the NHL has ALWAYS been this way and I've been watching it for about 30 years.

                Just like in baseball where every umpire has a different strikezone or football where one officiating crew might tend to call holding more than another.
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by STLCeltic@Apr 13 2004, 12:07 AM
                  did you watch both games dev? Two different sets of rules. How can you play a game like that?
                  Yes. I watched both games from start to finish, the Bertuzzi game as it was happening and a taped version of the Blues game this afternoon.

                  Officials have different interpretations of the rules, just as umpires have different interpretations of what is a strike and referees have different interpretations of what is holding or pass interference. You adjust. The Sharks were able to adjust, the Blues weren't.

                  And that still doesn't address my point in my previous post: every time a huge melee breaks out, broadcasters and columnists and fans ridicule the officials for failing to take control of the game. Well, on Saturday, the officials took control of the game. They called a lot of penalties early because the teams--especially the Blues--were playing a dirty game, using their sticks as weapons. And now Bernie, a columnist I have a great deal of respect for, is complaining about the officiating. Well, you can't have it both ways. The referees did what they had to do to make sure things didn't get even more vicious than they already were.

                  Furthermore, the critics of such a game would have a better argument if the calls in question were a bunch of borderline calls, but they weren't. Almost every penalty the Blues took was a blatant penalty that had to be called. Chris Pronger used his stick as a weapon twice and got a minor and double minor for it. Those have to be called. Keith Tkachuk got called for running over the goalie and for holding back a player in one end of the ice when the puck was in the other end so he could take a few swings at him. Those have to be called. Mike Sillinger got called for doing a mini-Bertuzzi late in the game after the whistle. That has to be called. If they aren't called, someone will eventually get seriously hurt because a player like Pronger will take a swing at a player...and then when that happens, the pundits will cry that the officials lost control of the game.

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                  • #10
                    Well we could debate all night, so lets find some common ground.

                    Yes, I think it's shit when a bad deed gets done and the columnists go nuts, then complain aboot bad officials.

                    Yes the blues were gooning it up in game 2. that was their plan all along. I don't think the sharks adjusted, they just stood back while the blues went to the box. some of the calls were questionable.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by CSD@Apr 13 2004, 01:10 AM
                      You adjust.

                      The Sharks, the young and unexperienced team were able to do it.

                      The Blues, the older and experienced team, weren't able to do it.
                      Just as teams in other sports must adjust.

                      Ever see the changing strike zone in baseball? How about the different rules for pass defense in the NFL? And don't even get me started about the NBA.

                      Unless you find a way to eliminate the human element in officiating no sport will ever have every game played every day by the exact same set of rules.
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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by STLCeltic@Apr 13 2004, 02:14 AM
                        ok maybe i'm missing something....in golf you adjust to the wind, terrain...but the rules don't change. Baseball you adjust to the pitchers, weather....but the rules don't change.

                        How do you adjust when the rules change? There has to be a consitancy.
                        In baseball the pitcher has to feel out the ump's strike zone first, much like grinders need to see what they can and can't get away with.
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                        • #13
                          The only input I have on this is, during a baseball game or football game, you are dealing with the same refs. During a 7-game hockey series, you most likely are going to be dealing with different ones everynight. One game is called one way, the next game is called another. As long as all the refs are somewhat consistent, then yes - a team should be able to adjust, and if they can't - they shouldn't be there. It's when the calls are inconsistent from one night to the next where you run into problems.

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                          • #14
                            A good official is one that you don't even know is there.
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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by devaskar@Apr 13 2004, 01:01 AM
                              Hilarious and completely off-base. Every time something like the Bertuzzi incident takes place, columnists around the country whine about how officials lost control of the game. Then they try to gain control of the game early yesterday and columnists complain that they over-officiated.
                              Interestingly enough, the ref for both games was Walkom. Even more interesting, he did a terrible job in each game.

                              If anyone actually feels that the officiating was good in the game that led to Moore having his neck broken, then we'll have no starting point for meaningful discussion. Yet, the same ref who was on the ice for the worst incident in hockey this season, gets a playoff assignment. Go figure.

                              What happens in the playoffs? He does another awful job. Who could have possibly known? The playoffs should be a reward, and while certainly everything that happened on the ice in Vancouver was not Walkom's fault, he was the one in charge of keeping things from getting out of hand. He didn't do his job, and he deserved to be watching the playoffs on TV, not the ice.
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