ESPN Insider: Burnett looking for 5-year deal

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Nov 4 - Agent Darek Braunecker told ESPN Insider Jerry Crasnick that A.J. Burnett is looking for a five-year contract. Braunecker and his partner, Mark Rodgers, plan to travel to the general managers' meetings in Indian Wells, Calif., next week to meet with prospective suitors.

Burnett went 0-4 with a 5.93 ERA in September on the way to a 12-12 finish with Florida this past season, but interest remains high in a weak market for free-agent starters. "I can tell you, 70 percent of the teams in baseball have contacted us about A.J.," Braunecker said. "It's certainly nice to be him right now."

Burnett came away impressed after a visit to Toronto, during which he met with Blue Jays officials and ace starter Roy Halladay. Former Jays pitcher Pat Hentgen even drove up from Michigan to help with the recruiting effort. But Braunecker said the process is "wide open," and it's too early to label Toronto the frontrunner.

Burnett plans to visit selected cities where there's an interest -- Seattle, for instance. But he expects to take a more low-key approach to free-agency than former teammate Carl Pavano, who parlayed a nationwide tour into a four-year, $40 million deal with the Yankees last winter.

Team w/ interest: Mariners, Blue Jays, Rangers? Red Sox? Orioles?

[/b][/quote]

[lazydaze]

give it to him

[TTB]

A 5 year deal is pretty risky for a pitcher...especially a guy with basically a .500 record and a history of arm trouble

No way Walt gives him a 5 year contract...4 at the most...the Cards just won't assume that kind of risk

The ONLY reason you give this guy a 5 year contract is the impact power shutdown type pitchers can have in the post season...and we will agree now the regular season matters little with the advent of 6 divisions and 2 WCs...however I think the Cards management is content to be consistently good enough to draw their 3 million...make the post season...and then roll their dice

[TTB]

I think Burnett will wind up in Boston or Baltimore

[Lippa]

I very highly doubt he ends up in Boston.

[TTB]

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 10:30 AM) Quoted post

I very highly doubt he ends up in Boston.
[/b][/quote]

Why...you guys didn't really replace Pedro and Lowe.

Clement is never gonna a big time pitcher and Wells is old...so is Schilling.

The other guys are marginal types.

Miller could break out but that's iffy.

[Lippa]

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 11:33 AM) Quoted post

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 10:30 AM) Quoted post

I very highly doubt he ends up in Boston.
[/b][/quote]

Why...you guys didn't really replace Pedro and Lowe.

Clement is never gonna a big time pitcher and Wells is old...so is Schilling.

The other guys are marginal types.

Miller could break out but that's iffy.
[/b][/quote]

Because they're not going to give big years and big money to a pitcher that hasn't earned it. The FO stresses payroll flexibility, and 4-5 years for AJ Burnett completely goes against that, especially when his performance hasn't warranted the AAV he'll want.

Plus, as it stands right now, the Sox already have Schilling, Wells, Wakefield, Clement, Arroyo, Papelbon, and maybe Miller as potential starters. Now, Wells wants to be traded, and it's likely Arroyo might go in a trade too, and I have no idea what Miller's actual status is. They MIGHT have an open spot in the rotation, but probably not.

They also have to worry about re-signing or replacing Damon, getting a 1B, and filling in the bullpen. And contrary to popular belief, they do have a budget, so there might not be room or dollars for Burnett, and I'm guessing that the FO is smart enough to realize he's a lot of hype and not much performance.

I think they'd rather take their chances that Schilling and Foulke come back healthy, which would go a long way towards fixing the pitching on a team that won 95 games essentially without them. If need be, they'll have the chips to make a trade if someone becomes available, and given the WS in '04, and the state of the farm with the young arms, they do have some leeway from the fans to build for the near future if it's the best approach. It's likely the 2007 rotation will have Schilling, and then Jonathan Papelbon and John lester in the 2-3 spots at cheap dollars.

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[Lippa]

Also, for this season, it makes more sense financially if they can sign BJ Ryan and put together a lights out pen, using the Angles model to circumvent average starting pitching.

[TTB]

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 11:01 AM) Quoted post

Also, for this season, it makes more sense financially if they can sign BJ Ryan and put together a lights out pen, using the Angles model to circumvent average starting pitching.
[/b][/quote]

Having some lights out starters is a better model for the post season. I agree that Burnett is a huge risk as I've already said that's why the Cards won't sign him. However, his potential to be a post season difference maker is huge.

The Sox won in 2004 and they could throw out Schilling, Pedro and Lowe (who had a good post season even though he had a mediocre regular season)...their pen was Foulke and pray for 8 from the starter pretty much.

Financial responsibility? You are talking like a Cardinal fan...not of a team that overpaid for likes Edgar Renterina and Matt Clement.
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img]

[Lippa]

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 12:09 PM) Quoted post

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 11:01 AM) Quoted post

Also, for this season, it makes more sense financially if they can sign BJ Ryan and put together a lights out pen, using the Angles model to circumvent average starting pitching.
[/b][/quote]

Having some lights out starters is a better model for the post season. I agree that Burnett is a huge risk as I've already said that's why the Cards won't sign him. However, his potential to be a post season difference maker is huge.

The Sox won in 2004 and they could throw out Schilling, Pedro and Lowe (who had a good post season even though he had a mediocre regular season)...their pen was Foulke and pray for 8 from the starter pretty much.

Financial responsibility? You are talking like a Cardinal fan...not of a team that overpaid for likes Edgar Renterina and Matt Clement.
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img]
[/b][/quote]


Yes, it's much better to have lights out starters. There's just no evidence that Burnett can play that role, nor anyone else on the FA market. That being the case, you're better off strengthening where you can --the bullpen-- and see where you are come June.

Again, they don't have to sell out to win this year, and as the White Sox showed, you never know where your ace pitching can come from. The best approach is to hope a 95 win team with an ace in place (assuming Schilling is really healthy now) might only need a couple of tweaks, and keep yourself open for 2007 and beyond when there might be a lot more options to improve the club.

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[TTB]

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 11:20 AM) Quoted post

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 12:09 PM) Quoted post

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 11:01 AM) Quoted post

Also, for this season, it makes more sense financially if they can sign BJ Ryan and put together a lights out pen, using the Angles model to circumvent average starting pitching.
[/b][/quote]

Having some lights out starters is a better model for the post season. I agree that Burnett is a huge risk as I've already said that's why the Cards won't sign him. However, his potential to be a post season difference maker is huge.

The Sox won in 2004 and they could throw out Schilling, Pedro and Lowe (who had a good post season even though he had a mediocre regular season)...their pen was Foulke and pray for 8 from the starter pretty much.

Financial responsibility? You are talking like a Cardinal fan...not of a team that overpaid for likes Edgar Renterina and Matt Clement.
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img]
[/b][/quote]


Yes, it's much better to have lights out starters. There's just no evidence that Burnett can play that role, nor anyone else on the FA market. That being the case, you're better off strengthening where you can --the bullpen-- and see where you are come June.

Again, they don't have to sell out to win this year, and as the White Sox showed, you never know where your ace pitching can come from. The best approach is to hope a 95 win team with an ace in place (assuming Schilling is really healthy now) might only need a couple of tweaks, and keep yourself open for 2007 and beyond when there might be a lot more options to improve the club.
[/b][/quote]

I don't know squat about your minor leaguers so if you think you have a couple guys on the cusp than I see your argument. That guy with the weird name is a hard thrower isn't he?

I will argue though that Burnett has shown enormous ability...its just that he can't do it consistently. If he had...he would be getting obsene money this winter...even as it is...he has shown enough that someone will give him what he wants...and then cross their fingers.

Go Cards ...12 in 13.

[Lippa]

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 12:24 PM) Quoted post

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 11:20 AM) Quoted post

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 12:09 PM) Quoted post

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 11:01 AM) Quoted post

Also, for this season, it makes more sense financially if they can sign BJ Ryan and put together a lights out pen, using the Angles model to circumvent average starting pitching.
[/b][/quote]

Having some lights out starters is a better model for the post season. I agree that Burnett is a huge risk as I've already said that's why the Cards won't sign him. However, his potential to be a post season difference maker is huge.

The Sox won in 2004 and they could throw out Schilling, Pedro and Lowe (who had a good post season even though he had a mediocre regular season)...their pen was Foulke and pray for 8 from the starter pretty much.

Financial responsibility? You are talking like a Cardinal fan...not of a team that overpaid for likes Edgar Renterina and Matt Clement.
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img]
[/b][/quote]


Yes, it's much better to have lights out starters. There's just no evidence that Burnett can play that role, nor anyone else on the FA market. That being the case, you're better off strengthening where you can --the bullpen-- and see where you are come June.

Again, they don't have to sell out to win this year, and as the White Sox showed, you never know where your ace pitching can come from. The best approach is to hope a 95 win team with an ace in place (assuming Schilling is really healthy now) might only need a couple of tweaks, and keep yourself open for 2007 and beyond when there might be a lot more options to improve the club.
[/b][/quote]

I don't know squat about your minor leaguers so if you think you have a couple guys on the cusp than I see your argument. That guy with the weird name is a hard thrower isn't he?

I will argue though that Burnett has shown enormous ability...its just that he can't do it consistently. If he had...he would be getting obsene money this winter...even as it is...he has shown enough that someone will give him what he wants...and then cross their fingers.
[/b][/quote]

Matt Clement had shown enormous ability too, and did it without the injurt concerns. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif[/img]

I'm just very skeptical of a 29 year old who's pitched 200 innings twice, has never won more than 12 games, and has a history of control problems. And for all the talk about how great his stuff is, he's never had a particularly high K rate. If I thought AJ Burnett could be the replacement for a Pedro and be the difference in being a real series contender, I'd be all for signing him. I just don't see any evidence that's the case. I think it's more likely that siging Burnett would be seen in 2007-09 as a reason they couldn't sign a real impact player in those years.

I'm not sure of the weird name guy you're referring too, but they do have 3-4 guys in AA and higher that can bring heat, and have matched it with performance.

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[TTB]

Clement has some good stuff...but he doesn't Burnett's stuff

If he did...he have had even more suitors last winter

Burnett remains a guy with huge potental...but he's a risk...no doubt about it

Your management has deep pockets...I'm not so sure they don't go after this guy and let Damon walk...or dig deeper and sign both

Where do you think he lands? Baltimore? Anaheim? NY?

[Lippa]

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 01:08 PM) Quoted post

Clement has some good stuff...but he doesn't Burnett's stuff

If he did...he have had even more suitors last winter

Burnett remains a guy with huge potental...but he's a risk...no doubt about it

Your management has deep pockets...I'm not so sure they don't go after this guy and let Damon walk...or dig deeper and sign both

Where do you think he lands? Baltimore? Anaheim? NY?
[/b][/quote]

Deep, but far from unlimited. They're already stretched tight and need to fill in certain positions. They certainly aren't about to expand the payroll, not by anything significant. And even if they did, I doubt they're all that enamored with him. The guy is going to be 29, and his performance has never matches his stuff, even in his good seasons. The guy's a lot more risk than potential reward at this point. He's far from being the difference maker on a contending team at this point.

I guess he ends up in Baltimore, which would probably be the best think for him preofessionally, with Leo Mazzone there.

[TTB]

QUOTE(Lippa @ Nov 5 2005, 01:35 PM) Quoted post

QUOTE(TTB @ Nov 5 2005, 01:08 PM) Quoted post

Clement has some good stuff...but he doesn't Burnett's stuff

If he did...he have had even more suitors last winter

Burnett remains a guy with huge potental...but he's a risk...no doubt about it

Your management has deep pockets...I'm not so sure they don't go after this guy and let Damon walk...or dig deeper and sign both

Where do you think he lands? Baltimore? Anaheim? NY?
[/b][/quote]

Deep, but far from unlimited. They're already stretched tight and need to fill in certain positions. They certainly aren't about to expand the payroll, not by anything significant. And even if they did, I doubt they're all that enamored with him. The guy is going to be 29, and his performance has never matches his stuff, even in his good seasons. The guy's a lot more risk than potential reward at this point. He's far from being the difference maker on a contending team at this point.

I guess he ends up in Baltimore, which would probably be the best think for him preofessionally, with Leo Mazzone there.
[/b][/quote]

Yeah, Baltimore is a good bet.

Don't they have a lot of their budget freeing up this winter?

Go Cards ...12 in 13.