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**ironman** · 10-13-2005, 04:27 PM

As I understand it, the Air Force team has to stop their prayer prior to game time as well.

**Guppy** · 10-13-2005, 04:29 PM

I see no problems with sports teams in HS doing what they did. Hell we did it for freaking SWIM MEETS and never thought twice about it.

**JMolina** · 10-13-2005, 04:34 PM

What's wrong with just instructing the kids who decline
to pray to just step over to the side?

No. That's too easy. The needs of the few outweigh the
needs of the many. I hope this coach has grounds for a
lawsuit against the school.

**Bleacher Creature** · 10-13-2005, 04:38 PM

Another erosion of common sense by the PC terrorists.

**Fishbone** · 10-13-2005, 04:50 PM

The link is blocked by the firewall here so I can't read the details, but how is it lacking common sense to not perform a team prayer, but rather have individuals pray on their own? Does that somehow undermine the significance/meaning of the prayer?

**Bleacher Creature** · 10-13-2005, 04:54 PM

QUOTE(Fishbone @ Oct 13 2005, 05:50 PM) Quoted post

The link is blocked by the firewall here so I can't read the details, but how is it lacking common sense to not perform a team prayer, but rather have individuals pray on their own? Does that somehow undermine the significance/meaning of the prayer?
[/b][/quote]

Team comaradre.

When I was 17, I wasn't a believer in Christianity. However, I was able to go through that moment as a part of the overall team.

Why do so many people find a moment of prayer, reflection, meditation, or silence so offending?

**Fishbone** · 10-13-2005, 04:57 PM

QUOTE(The Kev @ Oct 13 2005, 05:54 PM) Quoted post

QUOTE(Fishbone @ Oct 13 2005, 05:50 PM) Quoted post

The link is blocked by the firewall here so I can't read the details, but how is it lacking common sense to not perform a team prayer, but rather have individuals pray on their own? Does that somehow undermine the significance/meaning of the prayer?
[/b][/quote]

Team comaradre.

When I was 17, I wasn't a believer in Christianity. However, I was able to go through that moment as a part of the overall team.

Why do so many people find a moment of prayer, reflection, meditation, or silence so offending?
[/b][/quote]
Because I'd imagine it was a public high school and I'm imagine the prayer was geared towards Christians. Like I said, I can't read the details of the article so I don't know the specifics. If it were a silent prayer or a non-denomanational one, I wouldn't have a problem with it. If it were a Christian prayer at a public high school, then yeah, I can see the problem and why they were forced to stop performing it.

There are other, and far more effective ways, of building team camraderie through prayer. Say, the elephant walk or atomic sit-ups did wonders for my high school hockey team.

**JMolina** · 10-13-2005, 04:58 PM

QUOTE(Fishbone @ Oct 13 2005, 05:50 PM) Quoted post

The link is blocked by the firewall here so I can't read the details
[/b][/quote]

Popular High School Coach Quits Over Pregame Prayer

Marcus Borden Resigned After Being Told He Could
No Longer Lead Team Prayer

By Nina Pineda
(East Brunswick, N.J. -WABC, October 10, 2005) - The football coach worked at East Brunswick High School in New Jersey where administrators say he was offering a prayer before football games. The school says that's against the rules.

Eyewitness News reporter Nina Pineda is in East Brunswick with more.
We see it all the time in professional sports and we've seen it glorified in movies about high school football but school-led prayer at public schools isn't legal and when the coach, who's nationally recognized here, found out that he couldn't take part in that tradition anymore, he quit.

It's a ritual before every game. The team expresses words of thank and hopes of victory. It's a tradition honored for 23 years by East Brunswick Head Coach Marcus Borden, who resigned after being instructed he could no longer initiate or participate in team prayer.

Nancy Halupka, Mother: "Basically they give thanks to keep them free from injury and it's a very general, more of a ritual, you can call it a prayer. They do bow their heads."

While football parents say they didn't see the harm in the prayer the law is very clear about separation of church and state. East Brunswick administrators constitutionally cannot allow any teacher, coach or school representative to engage in school prayer.

Jo Ann Magistro, East Brunswick School Supt.: "Our students can pray in the locker room. Our students can pray at a pasta dinner but it cannot be initiated, led or participated in by an employee of a public school."

Martin Pachman, School Board Attorney: "Whether you invoke a Jewish prayer, a Christian prayer, a Hindu prayer, a Muslim prayer, it's all prayer and that's where the supreme court has drawn the line.

The school says several parents of various religious backgrounds complained about the school prayer. Coach Borden told Eyewitness News he's not ready to make a comment yet.

Football parents say that they hope he comes back and the superintendent says he can if he follows the law, a law some parents say they weren't even aware they were violating.

Nancy Halupka, Mother: "I'm going to say something that Yogi Berra would say: 'you don't know you don't have a right until you don't have it.'"

The school board has not accepted Coach Borden's resignation. He's still a Spanish teacher and was here Monday. He told us he would let us know what he plans to do, but as you can imagine anything that involves education, religion and football here in central New Jersey can really have people at odds.

(Copyright 2005 WABC-TV)

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